Volledig verslag van de vergaderingen

Donderdag 23 januari 2025 - Straatsburg

11. Uitgebreide interpellaties (debat)

  Priekšsēdētājs. – Nākamais darba kārtības punkts ir debates par plašu interpelāciju, uz kuru jāatbild rakstiski un kurai seko debates, un kuru ECR vārdā iesniedza Charlie Weimers, Sebastian Tynkkynen, Kristoffer Storm, Jaak Madison, Carlo Fidanza, Adam Bielan, Alexandr Vondra, Patryk Jaki, Johan Van Overtveldt, Roberts Zīle, Emmanouil Fragkos, Georgiana Teodorescu, Geadis Geadi, Marion Maréchal, Ivaylo Valchev, Kosma Złotowski, Mariusz Kamiński, Maciej Wąsik, Dick Erixon, Joachim Stanisław Brudziński, Beatrice Timgren, Nicolas Bay, Jadwiga Wiśniewska, Ondřej Krutílek, Guillaume Peltier, Michał Dworczyk, Laurence Trochu, Şerban-Dimitrie Sturdza, Tobiasz Bocheński un Gheorghe Piperea Komisijai par ES finansējumu fiziskiem robežu aizsardzības elementiem, piemēram, sienām, žogiem vai citām barjerām, pie ES ārējām robežām (G-001002/2024).

  Jaak Madison, author. – Mr President, first of all, we are pretty many Members here on the last day of the week.

First of all, in September, on September 20, 30 Members of the Parliament, so pretty many, have addressed written questions to the Commission. Unfortunately, we haven't got any answer in six weeks. So, c'est la vie, and the result is that we have to discuss the question here.

And I'm even more happy that on this very important topic, we can ask directly from the new Commissioner from Austria, who understands probably very well about the consequences of the illegal migration, about security, about the defence questions.

The question was about the EU funds and is there any kind of consideration in the European Commission to finance also the projects to protect our external borders physically? For example, in February 2023, the European Council implored the Commission to immediately mobilise substantial EU funds and means in order to help countries bolster their border protection capabilities and infrastructure.

Commission President von der Leyen has said that the EU will act to strengthen our external borders, specifically by providing an integrated package of mobile and stationary infrastructure from cars to cameras, from watchtowers to electronic surveillance.

Unfortunately, we understand very well that it's not enough to fight against, for example, the hybrid attacks by Russia, where they are using thousands of people as a weapon against Finland, against Poland, Lithuania, maybe next day to Estonia. And if those people are used by Russia's hybrid attack, how can we stop to move them to Germany, to Austria, to the inside of the European Union, thanks to the Schengen free movement that we have?.

That is why we had only two concrete questions: why has the Commission not yet recognised the reality on the ground at the EU's external borders and moved to lift its anachronistic moratorium on EU funding for physical border barriers?

And secondly, considering the ongoing hostile activities at the eastern border and the Member States have taken to constructing border barriers to counter the instrumentation of migrants, will the Commission change its approach and support Member States' external border barrier projects financially via the EU budget?

  Magnus Brunner, Member of the Commission. – Mr President, honourable Members, thank you, first of all, for bringing this very important topic to the agenda this afternoon. Let me start by saying that I fully agree with the imperative of reinforced management of our external borders. It must be, of course, us and not the smugglers who decide who comes to our European Union and under what circumstances. This is all the more imperative given precisely the hybrid threats you mentioned. Our response must be as united as it is resolute.

Coming from a ministry of finance for the last three years, allow me to start my intervention with some figures. In 2024, we saw a 38 % drop in irregular arrivals compared with the previous year. So it's 239 000 compared with 386 000. And this includes a sharp 78 % drop on the Western Balkan route and 59 % fall on the central Mediterranean route. And that's stated, as you mentioned, by President von der Leyen in her latest letter also to the European Council. This is the result of the EU's active engagement with our partner countries, and it is working. We see that and we must continue to pursue these efforts.

But, as you rightly mentioned, in parallel, we are very much aware that some regions are still under pressure, of course. In particular, there was a threefold increase in irregular crossings at the eastern border, in part as a result, as you mentioned, of the instrumentalisation of migrants by Russia and Belarus in their attempt to destabilise the European Union and undermine also our security. As a response, last month, the Commission issued a communication on countering hybrid threats from the weaponisation of migration and also strengthening security at the EU's external borders. The Commission recognised that Member States can take proportionate, on the one hand, and also temporary measures to address the threat posed by both Russia and Belarus.

Member States have the responsibility, of course, also to maintain law and order and safeguard national security. That's pretty obvious. But they do so with the support of the European Union and also its budget on a European Union level. Those Member States bordering Russia and Belarus have recently received additional funding of EUR 170 million to enhance border surveillance altogether.

This is just part of the broader picture of EU budgetary support to border management. All EU funding for border management has more than tripled over the past three multiannual financial frameworks (the famous MFF), with up to 7.7 billion allocated for border management and also visa instrument in the current 2021 to 2027 period. With these funds, the European Union is building one of the most advanced border management systems in the world and the largest share of this amount – that's EUR 4.3 billion – is allocated directly to Member States under their national programmes.

Also the EU's decentralised agencies – Frontex, eu-LISA, the EUAA, of course, the asylum agency – they also play a key role when it comes to border management, and their budget for the current period amounts to EUR 9.8 billion. In the future, the strengthening of Frontex with increased operational capabilities, including a tripling of its standing corps, will also further contribute to supporting the Member States – because that's what Frontex is here for – in addressing the challenges at the external borders.

I would therefore argue that not only has the Commission recognised the reality on the ground, but it is actively also supporting enhanced border management with substantial means, actually. I would also underline that this remains a key priority for me and for the Commission in general. And we are committed to continuing to strengthen the EU's external borders and supporting the Member States, of course, both operationally and financially, to boost border surveillance.

I am also very keenly aware, however, that budgets are limited, and the EU budget, of course, is no exception here. It is essential to make the most of every single euro, channelling it to where it is most effective at the end of the day and has the biggest impact, of course. Given these considerations, the Commission has so far focused funding, where the needs are the most urgent and where European money can have a real added value. This has included financing for mobile and stationary units, for border surveillance systems and equipment, for refurbishment of border crossing points, new installations for IT systems, plus also, of course, the maintenance of the equipment. All this increases situational awareness on border control capabilities, which are, of course, crucial for effective border protection, combined, as I said before, with continued support and also continued deployment by Frontex.

That is the picture of today: EU funding is available to Member States to provide well‑equipped and also modern infrastructure for a very high level of security at the European external borders and to help also combat irregular migration. These things must go hand in hand. On top of this, Member States can decide, of course, themselves to finance structures such as fences, for instance, themselves, while always ensuring, of course, respect for fundamental rights.

Now, the next step – and this is very important what I'm going to say now – going forward, Mr Madison, and following the trend also observed in the last years, it is clear that the overall needs for border management must be reassessed as part of the preparation of the next multiannual financial framework. This process is currently underway and should of course not be pre-empted. We will, of course, take into account the border management needs we have for the next months and years to come, which must be considered in a holistic manner for the different needs, priorities and resources available, whilst always ensuring that measures are, of course, proportionate and also respect fundamental rights.

The views of the European Parliament in preparation of that process are, of course, incredibly important. At the same time, constant engagement is necessary to achieve results on external border management, and the European Union will continue to deepen these comprehensive and strategic relations that it is building with key countries of origin, but also key countries of transit, including migration in the spectrum of key interests covered by these agreements.

  Lena Düpont, on behalf of the PPE Group. – Mr President, Commissioner, I'd like to address the topic of today on two levels: on a procedural one and on a content one.

On the procedure, as a representative of this House, of course, I also need to underline the request towards the Commission to respect the timelines and, of course, to adhere to the timelines. There's a reason why we set timelines for the answering of the questions, and I think that we can do more actually also to work together to come closer again in that sense.

On content, as it is mainly about instrumentalism – where, by the way, the ECR had the rapporteurship in the previous term – I think the question here at stake does not necessarily reflect the dynamic in the policy field. The Commission, the Commission President, they are in close debate with the Member States concerned. There are proposals on the table, both with financial support and additional money, but also in the adaptation of the policy response.

As a general remark, Europe is the strongest when we act together and we, as the EPP, will make sure to do so further down the road. And while I say that some here in the House need to accept that there is a thing such instrumentalism – that it is part of hybrid attacks, and it needs to be seen in the geopolitical context – other parts here in the House also need to accept that as well, because the very same reason why we are speaking about this cynical, state-sponsored and state-accepted smuggling business is Moscow and Minsk attacking – trying to pressure – the European Union.

So at least actors, some here in the House, want to align closer with. I would call that cognitive dissonance, but solve that out on your own. Rest assured that we, as the EPP, will go forward working on a common solution as a European Union that is strong and proud of its roots and values.

  Ana Catarina Mendes, em nome do Grupo S&D. – Senhor Presidente, Senhor Comissário, Caros Colegas, fiquei muito preocupada com o final da sua intervenção, Senhor Comissário, permita-me partilhar isto consigo.

Em 2021, quando se aumentou a verba para o Fundo de Gestão Integrada das Fronteiras, a Senhora Presidente da Comissão afirmou — e cito — «a União Europeia não financiará nem muros, nem arame, nem cercas». O Senhor Comissário terminou a sua intervenção a dizer: «vamos aumentar o financiamento para as cercas».

E queria dizer-lhe, em nome dos Socialistas e Democratas, que estamos totalmente de acordo que é preciso gerir as nossas fronteiras, mas gerir as nossas fronteiras não significa violação dos direitos humanos, como temos assistido frequentemente.

Por isso, as verbas que foram atribuídas — mais verbas —, para as fronteiras, para este fundo, não podem ser para as câmaras de vigilância, para as cercas, para os muros, porque isso é ao arrepio daquilo que tem sido a política de migrações da União Europeia ao longo dos anos.

E, por isso, Senhor Comissário, aquilo que lhe queria dizer é que tenha em conta os dados que aqui referiu, que eu, ontem, referi na minha outra intervenção, e que são verdade: em 2024, houve um decréscimo da imigração irregular em 38 %.

Isso significa, Senhor Comissário, que nós temos de continuar a estar atentos à implementação do Pacto das Migrações e ter uma visão humanista daquilo que é a imigração. Nós não vamos parar a imigração com a mão, como não paramos o vento com as mãos, é impossível. Os fluxos migratórios existem desde sempre.

A Frontex tem sido, muitas vezes, acusada de violar direitos fundamentais e, recentemente, a plataforma para a cooperação sobre cidadãos não documentados alertou para a violação sistemática, nas fronteiras, dos direitos humanos destes cidadãos, por isso, aquilo que lhe peço é que continue a ser o guardião dos tratados e a tratar as pessoas com dignidade.

  András László, on behalf of the PfE Group. – Mr President, EU countries want border walls and other barriers against illegal immigration, and the EU should pay for it. The majority of European leaders demanded that the European Commission immediately mobilise substantial funding for this. This was two years ago and Ursula von der Leyen did nothing.

What did the Commission do instead? They sued Hungary for defending the EU's external borders. For not allowing illegal entry into the EU, Hungary received a EUR 200 million fine. In addition, they demand that we pay a fine of EUR 1 million for each and every day that we refuse to give up our efforts to keep illegal migrants out of the EU.

European citizens don't want a Christmas like in Magdeburg. They don't want a New Year's Eve like in Brussels or Cologne. Europeans want tough border protection on the outer borders of the European Union. The radical ideology of Brussels elites about open borders is a failure. It goes against the will of EU governments, it goes against the will of European citizens and it goes against common sense.

Ultimately, European citizens pay the highest price for it. In 10 years, Hungary has already spent EUR 2 billion to defend the EU's borders on the south. In the east, several countries are now spending vast resources to keep illegal immigrants out.

Pay for the fence in Hungary; pay for the fence in Finland; pay for the fence in Poland and all other countries that defend our external borders. This was the demand of the European governments so that European citizens won't have to pay with their blood.

  Joachim Stanisław Brudziński, w imieniu grupy ECR. – Panie Przewodniczący! Szanowni Państwo, od czerwca 2021 roku Polska, Łotwa i Litwa doświadczają kryzysu na swojej granicy z Białorusią, gdzie dziesiątki tysięcy migrantów i osób ubiegających się o azyl, głównie z Afryki i Bliskiego Wschodu, próbowały przedostać się i próbują przedostać się do Unii Europejskiej przy wsparciu władz białoruskich. Od 2023 roku dołączyła tutaj również Finlandia. Już bezpośrednio Rosja, bez pomocy swojego pomocnika, jakim jest Łukaszenka, tak samo próbuje wepchnąć na terytorium Unii Europejskiej nielegalnych imigrantów.

Tymczasem nowe rozporządzenie kryzysowe, które jest częścią Paktu o Azylu i Migracji, odnosi się do problemu instrumentalizacji migracji jedynie z perspektywy prawa azylowego i jedynie poprzez zapewnienie bardzo ograniczonego katalogu odstępstw od obowiązujących przepisów, które mają być stosowane przez państwa członkowskie zaatakowane w ten hybrydowy sposób. Oczekujemy jednak, jako Europejczycy od Unii Europejskiej bardziej asertywnych rozwiązań, skupiających się przede wszystkim na bezpieczeństwie obywateli Unii Europejskiej. Rozwiązania takie powinny obejmować wzmocnienie infrastruktury granicznej, budowę barier fizycznych i modernizację systemu granic, współpracę organów ścigania i odpowiednie wsparcie Europolu i Frontexu z wykorzystaniem również narzędzi współpracy międzynarodowej, w tym skutecznej współpracy z państwami trzecimi w zakresie powrotów i umów o readmisji.

Szanowni Państwo, chciałbym przypomnieć też o sytuacji, która miała miejsce, kiedy ta hybrydowa wojna Putina się rozpoczęła. Byliśmy świadkami w tej Izbie festiwalu hipokryzji i wystąpień zgoła kabaretowych. Przedstawiciele nie tylko lewicy, ale również PPE atakowali w sposób grubiański i skrajnie niemądry ówczesny rząd polski, rząd Prawa i Sprawiedliwości za budowę muru na granicy polsko- białoruskiej i za ochronę granicy zewnętrznej Unii Europejskiej. Ba, nawet został zdymisjonowany ówczesny szef Frontexu, za to tylko, że wsparł ówczesne działania rządu polskiego. Nie kto inny, jak ówczesny lider PPE, sam Donald Tusk, grzmiał, że migranci zwiezieni przez Łukaszenkę to biedni ludzie, których należy wpuścić, bo przybywają oni tutaj w poszukiwaniu lepszego życia.

Europosłowie Platformy Obywatelskiej, którzy dzisiaj zasiadają w tej Izbie, pajacowali na granicy, atakując werbalnie funkcjonariuszy polskiej Straży Granicznej, policji czy wojska. A dzisiaj jesteśmy świadkami cudu. Nie kto inny, a ten sam Donald Tusk wczoraj z tego miejsca mówi, że najważniejsze jest bezpieczeństwo i wzywa do ochrony granic zewnętrznych.

Szanowni Państwo, jego kolega, pan Max Weber z tego miejsca gratuluje Tuskowi odsunięcie Prawa i Sprawiedliwości od władzy i wysyła premiera Jarosława Kaczyńskiego na emeryturę. Panie Weber, gdyby nie premier Jarosław Kaczyński, którego siła i wola polityczna powstrzymała ten nielegalny proceder, to te setki tysięcy migrantów miałby Pan dzisiaj w Berlinie, w Monachium i w innych miastach niemieckich. Jeżeli ktoś ma iść na emeryturę to Pan, Ursula von der Leyen i zabierzcie Tuska, dzięki Wam ma już wysoką emeryturę europejską.

  Fabienne Keller, au nom du groupe Renew. – Monsieur le Président, cher Roberts Zīle, Monsieur le Commissaire Magnus Brunner, nous avons eu ce débat de très nombreuses fois et, en dépit d'arguments logiques, factuels, et de statistiques démontrant que construire des murs aux frontières non seulement ne marche pas, mais que ce n'est pas non plus dans notre ADN européen, nous y voilà encore.

Contrairement à ce qu'aime prétendre l'extrême droite, il ne suffit pas de construire des murs à nos frontières pour régler la question de l'immigration illégale. Bien sûr que nous devons protéger nos frontières, nous organiser pour les faire respecter, comme vous l'avez expliqué, Monsieur le Commissaire; nous nous y employons. Mais la meilleure gestion de la migration et la meilleure protection de nos frontières, elle passe aussi par l'application de ce pacte, qui n'est pas encore en œuvre. En effet, un volet majeur de la mise en œuvre du pacte est consacré à cette protection des frontières.

Cela passe par la création de procédures accélérées aux frontières, d'un filtrage rigoureux, d'une base de données sur l'asile et la migration et de moyens budgétaires supplémentaires. Le pacte comprend également un volet de coopération avec les États tiers afin de prévenir les départs irréguliers, de lutter contre le trafic des migrants, de coopérer en matière de réadmission et de promouvoir des voies d'accès légales. Ce sont ces mesures novatrices que nous devons financer avec le budget européen.

Ce budget doit être utilisé pour rassembler. Il doit être mis au service des citoyens et de la solidarité. Le budget européen, chers collègues, doit construire des ponts, pas des murs.

  Mélissa Camara, au nom du groupe Verts/ALE. – Monsieur le Président, Monsieur le Commissaire, chers collègues, barrières, barbelés, divisions. Là est l'obsession d'une partie de la classe politique européenne. Partout où des États ont dressé des murs, ils n'ont semé que souffrance et désespoir. Aujourd'hui, une soixantaine de murs parsèment le globe de cicatrices de béton. Depuis une vingtaine d'années, les barrières physiques se multiplient aux frontières de l'Union européenne, en Hongrie, en Espagne, en Grèce, en Bulgarie. Ce sont désormais 13 % des frontières terrestres de l'Union européenne qui sont clôturées.

Les murs, donc, comme seule perspective politique, partout. Regardez ce mur entre les États-Unis et le Mexique érigé sous Bush, toujours plus haut sous Trump, plus de 1 000 kilomètres d'acier et de méfiance. Ce mur que, chaque année, des centaines de milliers de personnes cherchent à franchir, poussées par l'espoir d'une vie meilleure. Et ici, en Europe, c'est la même histoire. Ceuta et Melilla, par exemple. Une porte close, des regards détournés. Ces barrières ne résolvent rien. Elles brisent des vies, elles éteignent les rêves et tuent. Souvenons-nous du 24 juin 2022 à Melilla: le gaz lacrymogène, les balles en caoutchouc, des migrants piégés entre les clôtures, blessés, abandonnés, sans soins... 23 vies fauchées. Et combien d'autres en Europe?

Les murs n'arrêtent pas les pas. Ils allongent les routes. Ils poussent les exilés vers des chemins plus périlleux où l'ombre de la traite les guette. Les murs ne stoppent pas non plus les catastrophes humanitaires et climatiques, les guerres, les persécutions qui ont lieu partout dans le monde. Je l'ai dit hier dans une autre intervention et je souhaite le rappeler aujourd'hui: personne ne quitte son pays, ses repères, sa famille et ses proches par choix. Les murs ne protègent pas, ils séparent, ils creusent des fossés entre les peuples. Ils nourrissent la peur et la haine.

Puisque les murs ne suffisent pas, désormais, des caméras, des drones de surveillance et tout un arsenal numérique sont déployés aux frontières de l'Europe. Mais les gens continueront d'essayer. Leur permettre de franchir les frontières n'est ici qu'une question d'humanité et de solidarité.

Cette Europe forteresse n'est pas la mienne. Mon Europe est celle d'un accueil digne et inconditionnel, celle des droits humains et de l'égalité. Jamais nous n'accepterons la surenchère des moyens sécuritaires contre les personnes exilées, comme la droite et l'extrême droite de ce Parlement le réclament. Des milliards qui partent en fumée chaque année, pour quelle protection? Pour quel résultat, sinon la mort et le désespoir? Cessons enfin l'apathie morale. L'Europe doit choisir l'humanité, la solidarité, les ponts et refuser les murs.

  Christine Anderson, im Namen der ESN-Fraktion. – Herr Präsident! Europa wird angegriffen – nicht durch Panzer oder Raketen, sondern durch den Migrantenansturm auf unsere Grenzen, der als Waffe gegen uns eingesetzt wird. Und das funktioniert, weil wir uns von linken Spinnern haben einreden lassen, Pushbacks seien illegal. Pushbacks – also das konsequente Zurückweisen von Migranten an den Grenzen – sind aber das effektivste Mittel, um illegale Grenzübertritte zu verhindern und diesen Angriff auf unsere Heimatländer abzuwehren.

Dass wir sie nicht nutzen dürfen, verdanken wir einer massiven Lobbyarbeit von Pro-Migrations-NGOs, finanziert von exzentrischen Milliardären, die sich als moralische Instanz aufspielen. Tatsächlich aber gefährdet deren Agenda nicht nur die Sicherheit Europas, sondern Europa an sich. Jedes souveräne Land hat das Recht, ja, die Pflicht, seine Grenzen zu schützen. Die Behauptung, dass dies rechtswidrig sei, ist eine dreiste Lüge, die Europa jeder Möglichkeit der Selbstverteidigung beraubt.

Und natürlich brauchen wir physische Barrieren an den Außengrenzen – sie wirken, sie schützen, sind legal und legitim. Diese Zäune und Mauern sind nichts anderes als ein in Stacheldraht und Beton gegossener Pushback. Also bauen wir sie endlich, diese physischen Barrieren, und schützen wir endlich unsere Heimatländer und unsere Bürger.

Auch Sie, Herr Kommissar Brunner, sollten doch inzwischen zur Kenntnis genommen haben, dass die politische Landschaft im Wandel ist. Ihre christdemokratische Partei wird bald Juniorpartner der FPÖ sein. Sie werden Ihren Kurs ohnehin ändern müssen. Warum nicht jetzt? Und wenn nicht jetzt, wann dann?

Aber die nächsten Wahlen werden ohnehin zeigen, dass die Bürger keine Parteien mehr wählen werden, die sich weigern, die Grenzen zu schützen. Sie werden keine Parteien mehr wählen, die die Sicherheit der eigenen Bürger auf dem Altar imaginärer Rechte und Ansprüche von Millionen von rückständigen Masseninvasoren opfern und – mehr noch – sie ihnen erbarmungslos zum Fraß vorwerfen.

Kommen Sie endlich zur Besinnung. Handeln Sie – und zwar entschieden und jetzt!

  Φρέντης Μπελέρης (PPE). – Κύριε Πρόεδρε, κύριε Επίτροπε, αγαπητοί συνάδελφοι, η χρηματοδότηση φυσικών υποδομών προστασίας των συνόρων είναι μια λύση που αποδεδειγμένα λειτουργεί. Στη χώρα μου το πιο αποτελεσματικό μέσο αποτροπής παράνομων διελεύσεων είναι ο φράχτης του Έβρου. Πρώτον, γιατί θωρακίζει τα σύνορα της Ελλάδας αλλά και της Ένωσης. Δεύτερον, γιατί προστάτεψε την Ελλάδα και την Ευρώπη από την προσπάθεια εργαλειοποίησης του μεταναστευτικού από την Τουρκία. Τρίτον, ωθεί τους μετανάστες στις νόμιμες οδούς εισόδου και προστατεύει τα δικαιώματα όλων αυτών που δέχονται καθημερινά τις πιέσεις του μεταναστευτικού. Αυτοί είναι οι ακρίτες ευρωπαίοι πολίτες του Έβρου. Είναι αυτοί που σηκώνουν διαχρονικά πολύ μεγαλύτερο βάρος από όλους εμάς. Είναι πιο κρίσιμο από ποτέ να τους δείξουμε ότι δεν είναι μόνοι τους.

Η συζήτηση για το μεταναστευτικό είναι πάντοτε ιδεολογικά φορτισμένη, γιατί έχει να κάνει με την προστασία των ατομικών δικαιωμάτων και ελευθεριών, όχι μόνο των μεταναστών αλλά και των πολιτών της Ένωσής μας. Στην προηγούμενη κοινοβουλευτική περίοδο δεν αφήσαμε τις ιδεοληψίες ορισμένων να διαβρώσουν τις πολιτικές φύλαξης των συνόρων. Το ίδιο οφείλουμε να κάνουμε και τώρα. Η συνέχιση της χρηματοδότησης είναι μία από τις ενέργειες που ξεκαθαρίζει την αποφασιστικότητα της Ευρώπης προς τη νέα εποχή.

  Murielle Laurent (S&D). – Monsieur le Président, Monsieur le Commissaire, chers collègues, «structures physiques de protection des frontières», il s'agit là du titre de ce débat. Ce n'est en réalité que du verbiage politiquement correct pour parler de murs, de barrières, de barbelés. Cette sémantique nous renvoie à une période bien sombre de notre histoire.

La Communauté européenne a été bâtie sur un idéal de paix, d'union et d'ouverture. Notre but n'est pas d'ériger des murs, mais de les faire tomber, comme ce fut le cas le 9 novembre 1989 avec la chute du mur de Berlin. Financer de telles infrastructures serait une insulte à la construction européenne. Plutôt que de construire des murs, nous devrions consacrer notre budget à défendre la démocratie, menacée par les populistes et non par les migrants. Comme je l'ai dit hier, ici même, lors du débat sur les liens entre la criminalité et la migration: il n'y a qu'en assumant une migration positive, en mettant en place des voies légales de migration et en engageant des partenariats sérieux avec les autres pays que nous pourrons y parvenir. Non, ce ne sont pas des idioties, c'est du bon sens. Le respect des droits fondamentaux, c'est du bon sens.

  France Jamet (PfE). – Monsieur le Président, 30 000 personnes. 30 000 personnes sont mortes en tentant de traverser la Méditerranée, à la poursuite d'un eldorado fictif, à la poursuite d'un eldorado que vous leur avez vendu. Ces morts tragiques, elles ne sont pas à mettre sur le compte de la lutte contre l'immigration illégale, mais sur celui de votre idéologie sans-frontiériste, des pompes aspirantes que vous avez mises en place et de votre mansuétude vis-à-vis des réseaux mafieux de passeurs. On voit d'ailleurs à Mayotte, sur notre sol, aujourd'hui, le résultat de cette politique du laissez-faire.

Alors c'est vrai, construire des infrastructures pour stopper cette pression migratoire, qui pèse sur nos comptes publics, notre économie et la sécurité de nos compatriotes, ne sera pas suffisant sans un arsenal juridique et la volonté politique. Pour cela, il faut d'abord avoir le courage de dire: «Sachez que si vous entrez illégalement sur notre territoire, ce sera l'expulsion et le retour.»

  Riho Terras (PPE). – Mr President, colleagues, authoritarian regimes surrounding the Union have used migration as a tool to impose political and economic pressure.

The Member States and the eastern flank have been under pressure from the Russian regime and confronted with immigration attacks for several years now. It is our united and coordinated task to defend our borders against the attempts of weaponized migration and stop the illegal immigration entering the EU.

I strongly support more EU‑funded initiatives to strengthen our external borders and the use of the EU budget to build fences, as Commissioner Brunner mentioned, I support very much. We need to invest to improve physical infrastructure as well as into innovative solutions.

I am also glad that the Frontex is preparing to open a permanent base in Estonia and increase its presence along the EU's eastern borders to combat migration.

Brīvais mikrofons

  Kinga Kollár (PPE). – Tisztelt Elnök Úr! Európát csak mi, európaiak tudjuk megvédeni. Külső határainkat meg kell erősíteni az illegális migrációval és a határokon átnyúló bűnözéssel szemben.

A Tisza azt akarja, hogy a magyar emberek biztonságban éljenek. Nem akarunk illegális migránsokat, bűnszervezeteket, szabadon engedett embercsempészeket se Magyarországon, se más uniós tagállamban.

A megerősített határvédelem az EU közös érdeke, így az erre fordított költségek megtérítését joggal kérik az érintett tagállamok. A Tisza sürgeti, hogy az EU költségvetése is támogassa a hatékony fizikai határvédelmet, és ebből jusson új és meglévő határvédelmi eszközökre is.

  Bogdan Rzońca (ECR). – Panie Przewodniczący! Chciałem zabrać głos, żeby oddać hołd 21 letniemu Mateuszowi Sitkowi. Polski żołnierz, 21 letni żołnierz, został zabity przez bandytów na granicy polsko-białoruskiej. Zabity, zamordowany. I chcę o tym tu powiedzieć, bo wtedy, kiedy my, Polacy, broniliśmy granicy Unii Europejskiej, kiedy Putin i Łukaszenka wpychał uchodźców do Polski, prowadząc wojnę hybrydową, wy świetnie tu bawiliście się w Parlamencie Europejskim na fałszywym filmie polskiej reżyserki, która ośmieszała polską policję, polskich żołnierzy, tych wszystkich, którzy bronili granicy Unii Europejskiej.

Musicie się za to wstydzić. Będę wam o tym zawsze przypominał, dlatego że dzisiaj oczywiście ta debata jest ważna, cieszę się, że komisarz przyjął takie, a nie inne stanowisko, ale wołaliśmy o te pieniądze na granicy, o to bezpieczeństwo w poprzednich latach i się nie udawało. A wczoraj oklaskiwaliście Donalda Tuska, który tutaj, w Brukseli, powiedział tak: To, co robi polski rząd Prawa i Sprawiedliwości, to szpetna propaganda. A myśmy po prostu zwyczajnie bronili granicy Unii Europejskiej. (przewodniczący odebrał mówcy głos)

(Przewodniczący przerwał mówcy)

  Siegbert Frank Droese (ESN). – Herr Präsident! Ich hatte selber die Gelegenheit, als Bundestagsabgeordneter die litauische Außengrenze, die bulgarische Außengrenze zu besuchen, und es gab immer Kritik an den Finanzierungsmöglichkeiten durch die EU, dass eben zu viel humanitäre Maßnahmen gefördert wurden, aber kein robuster Grenzschutz. Insofern sind die Ausführungen von Politkommissar Brunner ein kleiner Fortschritt.

Alleine mir fehlt der Glaube an den Willen. Wir brauchen den Willen zur Festung Europa. Wir brauchen einen, wenn Sie so wollen, neuen Eisernen Vorhang an den Außengrenzen Europas. Aber wir brauchen auch im Inneren Europas Ordnung. Wir werden daher nicht umhin kommen, Millionen von Straftätern und illegalen Migranten auszuweisen. Also wir brauchen millionenfache Remigration innerhalb Europas.

Und das ist leider in Ihren Worten, Herr Politkommissar Brunner, überhaupt nicht vorgekommen. Solange dieses Thema nicht zentral als Aufgabe von Ihnen angesehen wird, kann ich leider Ihren schönen Worten keinen Glauben schenken.

(Brīvā mikrofona uzstāšanos beigas.)

  Magnus Brunner, Member of the Commission. – Mr President, ladies and gentlemen, honourable Members, thank you very much, first of all, for your interventions.

Border protection, I think we all agree, is a shared responsibility. We know the dimension of the challenge, definitely. And we will continue to dedicate also massive resources to meet it in cooperation, of course, with national authorities, with the EU agencies dealing with the topic, and with partner countries of origin and also of transit, as I said in my former statement.

EU funds will have a strong role to play in this, and the preparation of the next MFF will be the moment to reassess the needs for border management and how these can be better addressed, whilst always ensuring – and this is also very important – that measures are proportionate and of course respect fundamental rights.

I stand ready to engage with you on this in the weeks to come. I think that is very important. And I stand, of course, also ready to listen to you all.

  President. – Thank you very much, Commissioner.

The debate is closed.

Rakstiski paziņojumi (178. pants)

  Mariusz Kamiński (ECR), na piśmie. – Ochrona granic to fundament bezpieczeństwa narodowego. Niestety, pomimo kolejnych kryzysów na granicach zewnętrznych, ideologiczne podejście Komisji wciąż góruje nad zdrowym rozsądkiem. Komisja nadal nie uznaje realiów panujących na zewnętrznych granicach UE i nie znosi swojego anachronicznego moratorium na finansowanie przez Unię fizycznych barier granicznych. Nawet gdy Putin, planując agresję na Ukrainę, starał się destabilizować Europę zalewem migrantów, Komisja nie zmieniła tej postawy. To rząd Prawa i Sprawiedliwości, broniąc granicy i budując zaporę, uratował wówczas Europę przed chaosem, pomimo ataków ze strony Brukseli i wspieranej przez nią ówczesnej opozycji. Słyszeliśmy wówczas, iż nielegalne przekraczanie granicy to prawo, a nie przestępstwo. Pilnować tego prawa mieli urzędnicy Frontexu.

W obliczu trwającego od blisko 4 lat kryzysu, gdy na polsko-białoruskiej granicy z rąk przestępcy zginął polski żołnierz, wciąż mówi Pan o odległych planach, kolejnych przeglądach, o pracach nad nowym budżetem na lata 2028-2034. Jakim kontrastem do zaniechań Brukseli są zdecydowane działania nowej administracji amerykańskiej?

Ostatnie negocjacje nad sprawozdaniem w sprawie budżetu Unii, do którego złożyłem poprawkę o finansowaniu przez UE infrastruktury fizycznej na granicach zewnętrznych, udowodniły, że w Parlamencie można zbudować większość opowiadającą się za zdrowym rozsądkiem. Taka większość jest również obecna w Radzie. Niestety nowej Komisji wciąż brakuje odwagi, by znieść szkodliwe moratorium.

  Емил Радев (PPE), в писмена форма. – Политическата група на ЕНП твърдо подкрепя финансирането от ЕС на физически съоръжения за гранична защита, като стени, огради и други бариери, като необходима и ефективна мярка за защита на външните граници на Съюза. В условията на безпрецедентен миграционен натиск, организирана престъпност и заплахи за сигурността, стабилната гранична инфраструктура е от ключово значение за защитата на европейските граждани, поддържането на обществения ред и запазването на целостта на Шенгенското пространство. Инвестициите във физически бариери гарантират, че Европа остава сигурно място, предотвратявайки незаконната миграция, възпирайки каналите за трафик на хора и ограничавайки нелегалните преминавания.

Аз също съм убеден, че силните граници са предпоставка за ефективна система за убежище и миграция, която дава възможност на ЕС да се съсредоточи върху тези, които наистина се нуждаят от защита, като същевременно се бори със злоупотребите в системата. Физическите съоръжения, съчетани със съвременни технологии за наблюдение и засилено сътрудничество между държавите членки, осигуряват цялостен и ефективен подход за управление на границите.

Освен това финансирането на тези проекти от ЕС демонстрира солидарност с държавите на първа линия, като България, осигурявайки им необходимите ресурси за защита на общите европейски граници. Оставаме ангажирани с твърда, но справедлива миграционна политика, основана на сигурността, върховенството на закона и защитата на европейските ценности.