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Procedure : 2016/2573(RSP)
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O-000038/2016 (B8-0367/2016)

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Debates
Tuesday, 7 June 2016 - Strasbourg Revised edition

16. Follow-up to the resolution of Parliament of 11 February 2015 on the US Senate report on the use of torture by the CIA (debate)
Video of the speeches
PV
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  Przewodniczący. – Kolejnym punktem porządku dnia jest debata nad:

– pytaniem wymagającym odpowiedzi ustnej skierowanym do Rady przez Claude’a Moraesa w imieniu Komisji Wolności Obywatelskich, Sprawiedliwości i Spraw Wewnętrznych w sprawie działań w następstwie rezolucji Parlamentu Europejskiego z dnia 11 lutego 2015 r. w sprawie raportu Senatu Stanów Zjednoczonych dotyczących stosowania tortur przez CIA (O-000038/2016 - B8-0367/2016) (2016/2573(RSP)) oraz

– pytaniem wymagającym odpowiedzi ustnej skierowanym do Komisji przez Claude’a Moraesa w imieniu Komisji Wolności Obywatelskich, Sprawiedliwości i Spraw Wewnętrznych w sprawie działań w następstwie rezolucji Parlamentu Europejskiego z dnia 11 lutego 2015 r. w sprawie raportu Senatu Stanów Zjednoczonych dotyczących stosowania tortur przez CIA (O-000039/2016 - B8 - 0368/2016) (2016/2573(RSP)).

 
  
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  Bert Koenders, President-in-Office of the Council. – Mr President, honourable Members, as you know, the United States is an important partner for the European Union in the fight against terrorism. We all know as well that there have been very serious concerns and differences in the past over certain aspects of US counterterrorism policies, and the European Union has engaged with the United States on these issues for many years – on many issues, from waterboarding to rendition, all kinds of issues that run counter to international human rights standards.

This dialogue has enabled us to raise a range of issues and serious concerns that we have with the United States on this issue. It is important to highlight – we are now in 2016 – that President Obama formally ended the CIA programme within days of taking up office, and that was a very crucial decision. At the time, through an executive order, he prohibited any form of torture or ill-treatment, as well as so-called ‘enhanced interrogation techniques’ and secret detention.

We share the views expressed by President Obama at the time that these techniques are against our values and they do not serve the fight against terrorism. The Council has stated repeatedly that the fight against terrorism has to take place in full respect of international law, international humanitarian law and refugee law. That was true at the time and it is still true today. We can only tackle terrorism if we stay true to our core values and the European Union condemns all forms of torture and other ill—treatment under any circumstances and works towards their prevention and eradication within the European Union and worldwide as a priority of its human rights policy.

Now the programme that was referred to in the questions was stopped many years ago, and President Obama has brought US counterterrorism policies much closer to the approach we have here in the European Union, including the prohibition of what were called – as a euphemism, I am afraid – ‘enhanced interrogation techniques’ and the strong use of the criminal justice system.

Article 4 of the EU Treaty states clearly that national security remains the sole responsibility of each Member State. This means that the work of Member States’ intelligence agencies is outside the scope of the competence of the European Union and its institutions. Therefore, I understand some of your concerns that the Council has not given follow-up to the recommendations that are included in your resolution for the simple reason that the Council does not have the competence to do so according to the European Union Treaty.

Is that a satisfactory situation? The answer is obviously a ‘no’. Personally, as a European, I am ashamed that these practices in the past took place on European territory. I want to express on behalf of the Council that same shame today, but the Council has to act within the competences that are conferred on it by the Treaty. But this is not the end of the story, and I am sure that the Commissioner will also go into some of the aspects regarding her competence. It does not mean that the activities of individual Member States that take part in unlawful activities are without scrutiny. EU Member States are bound by the European Convention on Human Rights and the EU Charter of Fundamental Rights.

The counterterrorism actions of Member States, including alleged involvement in the CIA secret flights, are reviewed by the European Court of Human Rights. In the past, the Court has condemned the practice of illegal renditions on European territory in at least one verdict. Other inquiries are still pending so there is a solid judicial framework. The Council wants to underline the importance of this solid judicial framework from a political point of view, leaving at the same time the judgment to the courts, as it should.

Moving forward, it is important to continue to ensure that counterterrorism policies fully respect human rights, both at the European Union and Member State levels. What happened with renditions must never happen again.

 
  
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  Jan Philipp Albrecht, author. – Mr President, respect for fundamental rights and the rule of law is an essential element in a successful counter—terrorism policy. This Parliament has repeatedly condemned the CIA’s secret detention and extraordinary rendition programme which resulted in multiple human rights violations, including the use of torture and other inhumane and degrading treatment, abduction, secret detention, detention without trial and violations of the non-refoulement principle.

It is absolutely clear that, despite their particular nature, policies of national security and counter-terrorism are not exempt from the principle of accountability, and there can be no impunity for violations of international and human rights law. Accountability for extraordinary renditions, abductions, illegal secret detentions and torture is essential in order to protect and promote human rights effectively in the international, internal and external policies of the EU and to ensure legitimate and effective security policies based on the rule of law.

This Parliament has repeatedly called for a full investigation into the collaboration of EU Member States with the CIA’s secret detention and extraordinary rendition programme, for its recommendations to be followed up, for the examination of new elements that might emerge, and for its rights of inquiry to be fully made use of and developed.

The report by the US Senate Select Committee on Intelligence has revealed facts that reinforce allegations that a number of EU Member States, the authorities and the officials and agents of their security and intelligence services, were complicit in the CIA’s secret detention and extraordinary rendition programme, sometimes through corrupt means based on substantial amounts of money provided by the CIA in exchange for their cooperation. The report by the US Senate Select Committee on Intelligence rebuts CIA claims that torture revealed information that could not have been collected through traditional non—violent interrogation techniques.

The climate of impunity regarding the CIA programme has enabled the continuation of fundamental rights violations as further revealed by the mass surveillance programmes of the US National Security Agency and secret services of various EU Member States. The US must investigate and prosecute the multiple human rights violations resulting from the CIA rendition and secret detention programmes, and cooperate with all requests from EU Member States for information, extradition or effective remedies for victims in connection with the CIA programme. EU Member States must investigate the allegations that there were secret prisons on their territory where people were held under the CIA programme, and prosecute those involved in the operations, taking into account all the new evidence that has come to light. Member States must investigate fully recent allegations that illegal detention, rendition and torture took place on their territory, and prosecute those responsible.

We expressed our concerns regarding the obstacles encountered by national parliamentary and judicial investigations into Member States’ involvement in the CIA programme, the abuse of state secrecy and the undue classification of documents, resulting in the termination of criminal proceedings and leading to the de facto impunity of perpetrations of human rights violations. We therefore ask the Council if it has apologised for the breaching of the principle of sincere cooperation between the Union institutions, as enshrined in the Treaties, when it incorrectly attempted to persuade Parliament to accept deliberately shortened versions of the minutes of the meetings of the Council working parties on public international law and transatlantic relations with senior US officials. Did the Council issue a declaration acknowledging Member States’ involvement in the CIA programme and the difficulties encountered by Member States in the context of the inquiry? Did the Council give its full support to truth finding and accountability processes in the Member States? Did the Council hold hearings with relevant EU security agencies to clarify their knowledge of [microphone momentarily switched off] a programme and the EU’s response?

(The President asked the speaker to speak more slowly)

Did the Council propose safeguards so as to guarantee respect for human rights and intelligence sharing, as well as strict limit delimitation of roles between intelligence and law enforcement activities? All these questions are of the utmost importance, as well as the question to the Commission as to whether the Commission has put forward proposals for developing arrangements for democratic oversight of cross-border intelligence activities in the context of EU counter—terrorism policies. National security is not outside the rule of law or human rights. It must be accountable and the EU has its role in this.

 
  
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  Věra Jourová, Member of the Commission. – Mr President, I welcome Parliament’s continuous effort to follow this issue. The practices referred to in the report of the US Senate on the CIA detention and interrogation programme constitute serious violations of fundamental rights. The fight against terrorism cannot justify unlawful arrest, arbitrary detention, torture or other ill-treatment. However, I also need to note that national security is outside the remit of Commission competence. The Treaty does not give the Commission any competence to lead investigations into the actions of national intelligence and security services. Moreover, the Charter of Fundamental Rights only applies where the Member States are implementing EU law.

Finally, the relevant facts occurred before the Member States in question acceded to the EU. This notwithstanding, the Commission has consistently stressed since that all Member States concerned have to conduct in-depth, independent and impartial investigations to establish the facts. They should establish responsibilities and enable the victims to obtain compensation for damages. This is a positive obligation which derives from the European Convention on Human Rights and this has been recalled recently by the European Court of Human Rights.

When it comes to asylum and judicial cooperation, at the time of the execution of the CIA programme there were no EU provisions applicable to judicial cooperation between the EU and the United States. The two agreements with the United States, one on extradition and the other on mutual legal assistance, entered into force on 1 February 2010. They clarify and unify the legal framework of judicial cooperation in criminal matters with the United States. Likewise, at the time there were no EU provisions for the qualification and status of third country nationals or stateless persons as refugees, nor were there any EU provisions applicable to procedures for granting and withdrawing refugee status. Directives 2004/83/EC and 2005/85/EC entered into force and were transposed after these events.

Within the remit of EU law, the EU’s and the Member States’ actions against terrorism must always comply with fundamental rights standards. The EU-US agreements on extradition and judicial cooperation, as well as other relevant EU legislation against terrorism, must be implemented and applied in a manner fully compatible with the Charter of Fundamental Rights.

 
  
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  Roberta Metsola, f'isem il-grupp PPE. – Sur President, aħna u nagħmlu l-ġlieda tagħna kontra t-terroriżmu m'għandna ninsew qatt x'inhi l-istampa l-kbira u għalhekk x'inhuma l-għanijiet ġenerali tagħna li qed niddefendu.

Irridu nżommu dejjem quddiem għajnejna x'qed nipproteġu. Il-valuri, id-drittijiet u l-libertajiet tagħna li ħafna drabi neħduhom "for granted", qisu xejn mhu xejn, huma mhedda. Dan hu stat ta' fatt. Qed ngħixu fid-dell tat-terroriżmu għaliex insostnu li għandna d-dritt li ngħixu l-istil tal-ħajja li ngħixu. U aħna ddeterminati li nkomplu ngħixu din il-ħajja u b'dak kollu li jagħmilna ċittadini Ewropej kif qed ngħixu llum: ħajja normali bi dritt.

L-użu tat-tortura jmur kontra l-valuri li aħna niddefendu u nissiltu għalihom. It-tortura hija dejjem ħażina u qatt ma tista' tkun iġġustifikata. Ma nistgħux niddefenduha. Minn ħaġa waħda ċerti, li t-tortura qatt ma tista' tagħmilna ċittadini li ngħixu f'sigurtà. Il-mezzi li nużaw biex nikkumbattu t-terroriżmu jridu jkunu effettivi imma fl-istess waqt iridu jkunu fil-qafas tal-liġijiet internazzjonali u r-rispett lejn id-drittijiet bażiċi tal-bniedem. La għandna u lanqas nistgħu narmu l-prinċipji tagħna meta t-triq tagħna hi għat-telgħa.

Għall-kuntrarju, f'sitwazzjoni bħal din, irridu naħdmu aktar u nżidu l-isforzi tagħna dejjem b'mod leġittimu. Għalhekk ħloqna kumitat ta' inkjesta fi ħdan il-Parlament Ewropew matul din l-aħħar sena. Issa wasal iż-żmien li nitgħallmu mil-lezzjonijiet u l-iżbalji tal-passat u li nirrikonoxxu li huma l-qrati li huma l-istituzzjonijiet l-aktar adattati biex iwettqu investigazzjonijiet dwar proċeduri kriminali.

It-tortura m'għandhiex tkun l-arma tagħna, ma tirrappreżentax il-valuri u l-prinċipji tagħna, ma tirrappreżentax lill-Ewropa li nemmen fiha jien.

 
  
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  Tanja Fajon, v imenu skupine S&D. – V Evropskem parlamentu že skoraj deset let vlade članic Evropske unije pozivamo k resnemu ukrepanju.

Poročilo ameriškega senata je razkrilo, da je CIA uporabljala metode brutalnega zasliševanja in mučenja ljudi na evropskih tleh po napadih 11. septembra.

Evropske vlade morajo spoznati, da ne gre zgolj za sramotno, ampak za resno kršitev temeljnih pravic in evropskih vrednot. Na dan še vedno prihajajo novi dokazi.

Z delegacijo odbora LIBE smo lani jeseni obiskali Romunijo, a nam oblasti niso dovolile vstopa v stavbo domnevnega pripora.

Drugače je bilo pred tem v Litvi. Ravno poročilo Evropskega parlamenta o tej misiji je močno pripomoglo k razkritju nekaterih skrivnosti. Odločilna pa je bila, kot že omenjeno, objava poročila ameriškega senata. Ta ni le razkrila razsežnosti zločinov, temveč tudi, da je mučenje neučinkovito v boju proti terorizmu.

Po mednarodnem pravu za takšna dejanja ne more biti nikakršnega opravičila. In pokazati moramo, da smo resni tako, da tistim, ki so odgovorni, tudi sodimo. Šlo je za najbolj sistematični kršitve človekovih pravic in humanitarnega prava po drugi svetovni vojni na evropskih tleh.

Posamezne evropske vlade niso končale podrobnih preiskav v domnevno vpletenost, kaj šele, da bi ukrepale proti odgovornim ali prevzele vsaj moralno odgovornost.

Žalostno je, da se je do zaupnih podatkov iz poročila senata o mučenju očitno uspelo dokopati le hollywoodski filmski industriji. Medtem ko civilna družba, nevladne organizacije in celo zagovorniki priprtih tega niso dosegli. Več deset ljudi je še vedno zaprtih v Guantanamu, brez obtožnic ali sodnih postopkov.

Preiskave v posameznih državah članicah se morajo nadaljevati, da bomo lahko ugotovili mero vpletenosti. Te kršitve ne bodo nikoli izginile in nobena preproga ni dovolj velika, da bi jih lahko pometli pod njo.

Naša skupna odgovornost je, da zapremo to izjemno sramotno poglavje v naši evropski zgodovini in zagotovimo, da se kaj takega ne bo ponovilo nikoli.

Kolege pozivam, da na jutrišnjem glasovanju resolucijo odločno podpremo.

 
  
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  Kazimierz Michał Ujazdowski, w imieniu grupy ECR. – Panie Przewodniczący! Człowiek cywilizowany nie może zachować się inaczej, musi potępić tortury, musi potępić więzienie ludzi bez sądu, stosowanie nadzwyczajnych środków. Chciałbym jednak powiedzieć szczerze, że mam pewne wątpliwości co do sposobu prezentowania tej sprawy w Parlamencie Europejskim. Po pierwsze, jak powiedział pan minister reprezentujący prezydencję, Stany Zjednoczone zamknęły program, który mógł budzić ostrą krytykę i który pewnie będzie jeszcze przedmiotem badań. Pani komisarz Jurova powiada, że w tamtym czasie nie istniało instrumentarium Unii Europejskiej, nie istniały porozumienia prawne, nie istniały zobowiązania. Prezydencja przypomina, ja też chcę to przypomnieć, że kwestia bezpieczeństwa narodowego jest w polu odpowiedzialności państw członkowskich i tam właśnie powinny toczyć się postępowania ustalające te fakty. Jest to kwestia suwerennych decyzji tych państw.

Parlament Europejski ma pełne prawo zwracania się do opinii publicznej, mobilizowania opinii publicznej, ale czy ma prawo prowadzić postępowania śledcze? Myślę, że na podstawie traktatów takie postępowania może prowadzić w odniesieniu do samych instytucji europejskich, a nie państw członkowskich. Więc jest tutaj potrzeba pewnej racjonalności w działaniu.

Nikt nie może przejść obojętnie wobec faktów używania niecywilizowanych metod, wobec tortur. W tej dyskusji jednak nie ma terrorystów. O to chciałbym zapytać: dlaczego w tej dyskusji nie ma terrorystów? To oni chcą zniszczyć naszą cywilizację. Jasne jest, że nie można walczyć z terroryzmem nadużywając praw człowieka, uderzając w prawa człowieka, ale też nie można tak interpretować praw człowieka, by wolny świat był sparaliżowany w walce z terroryzmem.

 
  
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  Sophia in 't Veld, on behalf of the ALDE Group. – Mr President, I was a member of the committee of inquiry into the CIA renditions programme and the Flight Stats about 10 years ago now. You might ask why we are still discussing this after 10 years. Why are we still repeating the same statements? But I can tell you that I will never tire of this until justice is done.

We can all talk about whether the legal framework was in place at the time or whether it is a matter of national sovereignty, but actually I get the feeling that the Council and the Member States are hiding behind legalistic arguments. If it is true, as Minister Koenders says, that national security is a purely national matter then I would like to understand why it was that the Member State governments back in, I believe, October 2001 collectively decided to allow CIA flights in European airspace.

They collectively decided that, but now they are hiding behind the argument that it is a national matter. When it is about accountability and about responsibility, all of a sudden it is a national matter. No, I think that if the governments at the time had the courage to take that decision collectively, then they should now be accountable and responsible collectively as well, and not hide behind these arguments.

Then you say, Minister Koenders, but we have the judiciary and we have a solid judicial framework. Well, I actually observed that Member State governments of different colours (irrespective of the colour, I might say) have gone out of their way to frustrate judicial investigations and prosecutions. They have tried everything in their power to stop those processes.

You mentioned the word ‘shame’. I very much agree with you. It is an absolute shame that 10 years after the first report in the European Parliament we are still talking about this and, as Dick Marty said at the time, it is like talking to a rubber wall. It is as if we are not heard. But we will keep discussing this until justice is done. No impunity in the European Union, because that, Minister Koenders, that is shameful.

 
  
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  Marie-Christine Vergiat, au nom du groupe GUE/NGL. – Monsieur le Président, cela fait effectivement dix ans que le Parlement travaille sur les allégations de détention, de torture, d'emprisonnement et donc les activités illégales de la CIA dans l'Union européenne.

À chaque rendez-vous dans cet hémicycle, certains groupes, sous la pression des gouvernements concernés, cherchent à empêcher la poursuite de nos travaux, et ils continuent.

En l'espèce, les violations de ces droits fondamentaux sont graves et pour le compte d'une puissance étrangère. Elles sont avérées et dénoncées, y compris par le Sénat américain.

Les États membres et le Conseil ne peuvent se cacher derrière les traités.

La honte ne suffit pas, Monsieur le Ministre. Les États membres doivent mener les enquêtes. Nous voulons la vérité, car c'est le seul moyen pour éviter que de tels faits se reproduisent, pour que les victimes aient enfin droit à la justice. Rien ne justifie la torture, rien!

Enfin, je voudrais profiter de cette intervention pour regretter que, contrairement aux promesses faites par le président Obama, la prison de Guantanamo ne soit toujours pas fermée et que des hommes y croupissent, en dehors de toute légalité.

 
  
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  Eva Joly, au nom du groupe Verts/ALE. – Monsieur le Président, en décembre 2014, le Sénat américain a publié un rapport sur l'usage de la torture par la CIA. Ce rapport confirme les suspicions concernant l'implication de plusieurs États membres dans des programmes de détention illégale et le fait que l'usage de la torture a été toléré sur le sol européen de 2001 à 2006.

Les responsables de ces actes doivent être jugés. L'inaction des États membres et des institutions européennes, à cet égard, est inacceptable. Nous ne pouvons tolérer l'impunité face à de telles violations des droits de l'homme. Les enquêtes doivent se poursuivre.

Que des groupes politiques au sein de cette Assemblée appellent à l'arrêt des travaux du Parlement européen sur ces atteintes multiples et terribles aux droits de l'homme et s'opposent à ce que toute la lumière soit faite sur ces pratiques illégales et la complicité de certains États membres est une honte. Les institutions européennes doivent s'assurer que l'opacité et les difficultés auxquelles les États font face dans le cadre de ces enquêtes soient levées. Tant que toute la vérité n'aura pas été établie, notre responsabilité est de faire en sorte que les enquêtes se poursuivent. Il en va de la crédibilité de nos institutions, notamment celle du Parlement européen, qui a, jusqu'ici, sauvé l'honneur de l'Union européenne.

J'espère, chers collègues, que vous saurez lui faire tenir le cap.

 
  
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  Ignazio Corrao, a nome del gruppo EFDD. – Signor Presidente, onorevoli colleghi, diciamocelo chiaramente, qualcuno lo ha già ripetuto: è una vera vergogna, è una vergogna ammettere che, dopo quindici anni, dopo che è stata approvata una risoluzione in questo Parlamento un anno e mezzo fa, non si sia ancora mossa una foglia. Non è stata aperta un'indagine. Gli Stati membri continuano a nascondersi dietro il quadro normativo o addirittura dietro il segreto di Stato. Non è in alcun modo accettabile un atteggiamento del genere, perché nel momento in cui noi accettiamo che all'interno dei nostri Stati membri – è successo in Romania, è successo in Polonia, è successo in Lituania, ed è stato accertato dal rapporto del Senato americano – vengano eseguiti atti di tortura, trattamenti inumani e degradanti, stiamo accettando che possa succedere ad ognuno di noi. Quindi credo che sia arrivato davvero il momento di alzare la voce e chiedere che i colpevoli paghino, perché continuando avanti così non si va davvero da nessuna parte.

 
  
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  Κωνσταντίνος Παπαδάκης ( NI). – Κύριε Πρόεδρε, αβίαστο είναι το συμπέρασμα από τις αποκαλύψεις για τα φρικτά βασανιστήρια της CΙΑ σε κράτη μέλη της Ευρωπαϊκής Ένωσης, στο Γκουαντάναμο και στις Ηνωμένες Πολιτείες. Οι Ηνωμένες Πολιτείες, η Ευρωπαϊκή Ένωση και οι κυβερνήσεις της, που ευθύνονται, έμειναν και μένουν στο απυρόβλητο. Οι επιτροπές που στήθηκαν ήταν κυριολεκτικά για να ξεπλύνουν τις ευθύνες των ιμπεριαλιστών.

Πάει πολύ να προβάλλετε την Ευρωπαϊκή Ένωση ως υπερασπιστή των ανθρωπίνων δικαιωμάτων, την ίδια στιγμή που καλείτε σε ενίσχυση της λεγόμενης αντιτρομοκρατικής συνεργασίας με τις Ηνωμένες Πολιτείες, στο όνομα της οποίας πραγματοποιείτε ιμπεριαλιστικούς πολέμους και βασανιστήρια. Κατασταλτικοί μηχανισμοί των Ηνωμένων Πολιτειών, της Ευρωπαϊκής Ένωσης, του ΝΑΤΟ και υπηρεσίες όπως η CΙΑ, ο ευρωστρατός, η ΚΕΠΠΑ, η Εuropol, η νέα συνοριοφυλακή-ακτοφυλακή συνεργάζονται στενά για το χτύπημα του λαϊκού κινήματος την καταστολή προσφύγων και μεταναστών. Ανταγωνίζονται στην κρατική και βιομηχανική κατασκοπεία για τα κέρδη των μονοπωλίων τους. Οι ίδιοι χρηματοδότησαν την αποκρουστική δράση μηχανισμών όπως το ισλαμικό κράτος. Οι λαοί μπορούν να αχρηστέψουν τους αντιδραστικούς μηχανισμούς που υπερασπίζονται την καπιταλιστική βαρβαρότητα, παίρνοντας οι ίδιοι την εξουσία και την ιδιοκτησία του πλούτου που παράγουν.

 
  
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  David McAllister (PPE). – Mr President, torture cannot be justified – under no conditions at all. Therefore, I also condemn the practices of interrogation techniques as they were reported by the US Senate.

The United States play a crucial role in fighting terrorism around the world, including here in Europe. Our cooperation on counter-terrorism needs to be preserved for the shared benefits of citizens on both sides of the Atlantic, and in full respect of all fundamental freedoms. I believe we need a continued political dialogue between the Transatlantic partners on security and counterterrorism issues, including on the protection of civil and human rights, in order to combat terrorism effectively.

In times of global instability, the Transatlantic relationship is of unique importance and of strategic nature. Having the US Senate report on the use of torture by the CIA in mind, I would like to underline what I consider being one of the key messages of the US—EU joint statement of 15 June 2009 on the closure of Guantanamo Bay and future counter—terrorism cooperation: joint efforts to combat terrorism must comply with international law, in particular with human rights like the rights to human treatment free trial and the freedom from torture. There can be no exception at all.

 
  
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  Ana Gomes (S&D). – Mr President, European Court of Human Rights judgments passed in the cases of Al-Nashiri and Abu Zubaydah versus Poland, pending respectively versus Romania and Lithuania, and Nasr and Ghali versus Italy plus El-Masri versus fYROM, and judicial decisions in the UK in favour of victims of torture all prove that European governments lied to this Parliament to callously cover up active complicity with the CIA extraordinary renditions torture programme. Worse, that cooperation was paid for with large sums of money, as the US Senate Intelligence Committee of December 2015 reveals. Even worse, impunity has been granted by EU states to those responsible for these crimes.

In Italy, for instance, state secrecy was used to block the judiciary and, as a result, innocent, low—level officers were convicted, while top culprits are protected. Italy now wants to put in jail the Portuguese American, Sabrina de Sousa, a former CIA officer who was tried in absentia and never given the chance to prove her denial of any involvement. Even the victim of torture and kidnapping in that case, Mr Abu Omar, the imam of Milan, has stated that she is only a scapegoat. In my country, Portugal, all cover up efforts were made to protect Mr Durão Barroso who, as Prime Minister, abetted the CIA renditions programme, as I reported in detail to the General Public Prosecutor. The case was closed to spare him, and in the meantime he was made President of the European Commission. How can our governments be credible in the eyes of citizens to effectively fight terrorism if they are complicit in covering up these awful crimes? I will never give up looking for accountability in this case.

 
  
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  Martina Anderson (GUE/NGL). – Mr President, Amnesty International confirmed that Shannon Airport in Ireland had been used by the CIA and the US military for extraordinary rendition flights. Torture techniques used by the CIA and the Bush administration were due to the European Court ruling which concluded that the 14 Irishmen, known as the Hooded Men, suffered inhumane and degrading treatment, but not torture. So that gave the Bush administration ‘cover’ to use the five torture techniques. But the British Government told lies to the European Court and the British Secretary of State has now been compelled to give further evidence.

The 14 Irishmen underwent horrific interrogations from which they never recovered. Hundreds more like them have been tortured by the CIA. The rapporteur is right. It was torture. It breached international law and such criminal behaviour must be exposed and challenged, at the very least to prevent other Member States from torturing and – as was the case in Ireland – governments being involved in the murder of people.

 
  
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  Zoltán Balczó (NI). – Elnök Úr! Lassan tíz éve annak, hogy az Európai Parlament foglalkozik a CIA-nak azzal az akciójával, amelynek során illegálisan és titkosan foglyokat szállított és tartott börtönben uniós tagországokban. A bizonyítékok ismertek, de a beismerés még várat magára. Minden dokumentumban az „állítólagos” jelző szerepel. Az érintett tagországok pedig nem működnek közre az ügy tisztázása érdekében. A felelős megnevezése minden dokumentum alatt: CIA. Na de hát a CIA nem egy ország! Nem merjük kimondani az Egyesült Államok legfelsőbb vezetőinek a felelősségét? Félünk a „nagy testvérnek” a rosszallásától? Éppen itt lenne az ideje annak, hogy a tényeket, az igazságot egyértelműen, világosan rögzítsük, és ezek után elvárjuk, hogy ennek következményei is legyenek.

 
  
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  Jeroen Lenaers (PPE). – Het is niet de eerste keer dat we dit punt op de agenda hebben staan. Al meerdere malen hebben wij onze afschuw uitgesproken over de martelpraktijken van de CIA. Afschuwelijke mensonterende praktijken als waterboarden, slaapontzegging of het rectaal inbrengen van voedsel hebben geen enkele plek in een rechtsstaat in de 21e eeuw. Terrorisme moet bestreden worden zonder dat wij onszelf tot terreur verlagen.

Ik ben het eens met de collega's die zeggen dat we nog steeds niet alle informatie boven tafel hebben over wat er zich afgespeeld heeft. Ik ben het ook met die collega's eens dat dat betreurenswaardig is en ik zou dolgraag hier vanuit het Europees Parlement met een toverstok zwaaien en alle informatie boven tafel krijgen. Maar zo werkt het in de praktijk helaas niet. We zullen – en dat wordt ook bevestigd door de eigenlijk teleurstellende resultaten die we de afgelopen twee jaar gezien hebben van de commissie die we hier in het Parlement hebben opgezet – dus ook realistisch moeten zijn en naar onze eigen competenties moeten durven kijken. Dit verhaal moet verder opgevolgd worden in nationale parlementen, nationale rechtszalen en Europese rechtszalen.

Dan heb ik nog een vraag aan de collega's van de liberale fractie. Er werden net grote woorden gesproken over de laksheid van instellingen en de laksheid van lidstaten. Wij hebben hier morgen een resolutie liggen waarin wordt betreurd dat er tijdens het afgelopen mandaat vanuit het Europees Parlement maar één missie georganiseerd is. Dan stel ik mijzelf de vraag: hoe kan het zijn dat van alle zeventig leden van de liberale fractie niemand bereid was de moeite te nemen om ook daadwerkelijk deel te nemen aan die missie?

 
  
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  Carlos Coelho (PPE). – Senhor Presidente, Senhor Presidente do Conselho, Senhora Comissária, caras e caros colegas, há já vários anos que discutimos este assunto. O secretismo que rodeou este programa no início levou a que só muito lentamente tenha sido possível tornar claro o que realmente se passou. Só muito lentamente responsabilidades têm sido apuradas e, sejamos claros, ainda não está tudo apurado. Compete-nos, por isso, continuar a dar os impulsos necessários, respeitando o princípio da subsidiariedade onde ele deve ser respeitado e a separação entre o poder judicial e o poder político.

Por outro lado, este tema não pode servir para uma cruzada moral, um mero instrumento para propaganda ideológica. Não pode tão-pouco ignorar o nosso interlocutor do outro lado do Atlântico.

E não é apenas o apuramento da verdade e das responsabilidades que nos move. Também nos move a vontade de impedir que violações tão ostensivas de direitos fundamentais se possam repetir no futuro. Consideramos que os direitos fundamentais dos cidadãos estão no centro dos valores da União Europeia e que a sua proteção é uma exigência, mesmo face aos abusos dos Estados.

Esta é, pois, uma missão que temos de prosseguir em respeito pelo passado que ainda não está todo esclarecido e em nome de um futuro que queremos melhor e mais respeitador dos direitos e da dignidade da pessoa humana.

 
  
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  Daniel Buda (PPE). – Domnule președinte, drepturile omului, libertățile fundamentale și respectarea demnității umane sunt valori comune ale democrației, ale statului de drept, care trebuie să se reflecte în toate domeniile de politică internă și externă ale Uniunii Europene. Lupta împotriva terorismului presupune deopotrivă respectarea demnității umane, a vieții private și a tot ceea ce înseamnă drepturile fundamentale ale omului. Uniunea Europeană trebuie să fie garantul respectării drepturilor și libertăților fundamentale, dar, în același timp, și al securității cetățenilor. Consolidarea relațiilor transatlantice în lupta pentru combaterea terorismului trebuie să capete noi valențe în beneficiul tuturor, având la bază interese și valori comune.

Apreciem însă că politizarea excesivă a subiectului legat de existența închisorilor secrete, precum și posibila implicare de către CIA a unor țări din Uniunea Europeană în transportarea și deținerea ilegală de prizonieri este de natură să afecteze tocmai procesul demarat în unele state membre de aflare a adevărului și tragerea la răspundere a celor vinovați.

Este de datoria noastră să lăsăm statelor membre posibilitatea de a-și finaliza anchetele judiciare proprii și să nu intervenim în procesele judiciare începute, respectând astfel principiul imparțialității și independenței justiției, convinși fiind că, dacă au existat încălcări ale legii, se va face lumină. Este important ca, de la înălțimea Parlamentul European, să dăm expresia unei convingeri puternice și ferme că este absolut necesar să deținem dovezi clare înainte de a face nominalizări și de a ne angrena în dezbateri sterile, care nu se finalizează cu rezultate concrete.

 
  
 

Pytania z sali

 
  
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  Νότης Μαριάς ( ECR). – Κύριε Πρόεδρε, καταδικάζουμε τις πρακτικές των βασανιστηρίων από τη CΙΑ στο Γκουαντάναμο και σε άλλα κολαστήρια. Το σύστημα των μυστικών κρατήσεων της CΙΑ οδήγησε σε μαζικές παραβιάσεις ανθρωπίνων δικαιωμάτων και σε φρικτά βασανιστήρια. Οι μυστικές κρατήσεις της CΙΑ περιελάμβαναν απάνθρωπη και ταπεινωτική μεταχείριση, βασανιστήρια, απαγωγές και κρατήσεις χωρίς δίκη. Η χρήση βασανιστηρίων δεν επιτρέπεται και βέβαια δεν μπορεί να δικαιολογηθεί και να νομιμοποιηθεί για κανένα λόγο, ούτε βέβαια για τη δήθεν αποκάλυψη πληροφοριών προκειμένου να χτυπηθεί η τρομοκρατία. Φυσικά, η ατιμωρησία σχετικά με τις τακτικές που ακολουθεί η CΙΑ επιτρέπει τη συνέχιση της παραβίασης των ανθρωπίνων δικαιωμάτων. Για τον λόγο αυτό είναι αναγκαίο η Ευρωπαϊκή Ένωση να καταδικάσει κάθε μορφή παραβίασης των ανθρωπίνων δικαιωμάτων που έλαβε χώρα από τη CIA καθώς και να φροντίσει να διεξαγάγει περαιτέρω έρευνες σχετικά με τα κράτη μέλη της τα οποία σύμφωνα με την έκθεση ήταν συνένοχα στο πρόγραμμα μυστικών υπηρεσιών και έκτακτων παραδόσεων της CIA.

 
  
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  Bill Etheridge (EFDD). – Mr President, let us remember that the USA is officially our ally, despite the fact that its President’s recent interventions in the UK made me question his personal goodwill. Its security services are not under EU control; nor, thankfully, are the UK intelligence services – undoubtedly the best in the world, and we are very grateful for what they do.

Yes, intelligence services should interrogate as humanely as possible; absolutely they should. But their work must not be hampered by politicians and their political principles to the degree where we are put in danger. The human rights of terrorists must never be allowed to trump the right to freedom and safety of innocent citizens. Unfortunately you cannot break a terrorist down by putting them on the naughty step.

 
  
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  Ruža Tomašić (ECR). – Gospodine predsjedniče, mučenje i drugi oblici nečovječnog postupanja ne smiju biti prihvatljivi kao metoda u borbi protiv terorizma. Smatram da bismo s ovog mjesta morali poslati jasnu poruku da osuđujemo sve obavještajne aktivnosti i domaćih i partnerskih službi u kojima su ljudi mučeni na europskom tlu.

Svjesna sam da određeni obavještajni krugovi ovakvu praksu smatraju vrlo učinkovitom u prikupljanju informacija koje bi mogle pomoći u sprječavanju novih napada, kao i da će dio građana zbog sve češćih napada i pod dojmom stravičnih slika s mjesta događaja smatrati da je u redu uzvratiti istom ili sličnom mjerom.

Bit će sve više pritisaka da se, barem dok opasnost ne prođe, odreknemo ljudskosti i svojih kršćanskih vrijednosti. Ako na to pristanemo, nećemo biti ništa drukčiji od onih protiv kojih se borimo.

 
  
 

(Koniec pytań z sali)

 
  
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  Věra Jourová, Member of the Commission. – Mr President, even though, as I said before, the matter falls under national competence, the Commission has been following this issue closely and encouraged Member States to ensure, within the remit of their competences, that such a situation does not arise again.

 
  
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  Bert Koenders, President-in-Office of the Council. – Mr President, thank you for this interesting exchange of views. I think first of all we have all agreed, without any exception, that human rights and the rule of law and the fight against terror is something that can never be put in a relationship at the cost of one giving up the rights of people for the other. I think that is important. It is important to note that because we are still today fighting terror and terrorism and therefore I think all the research, the investigations, the reports that have been made were extremely important to enlighten us about what happened at the time.

I have said also in the first part of my declaration what the view of the Council is, ranging from the way we look at the policies of President Obama to correcting what has happened before, including the so-called enhanced interrogation techniques, secret detention and the like. Secondly, I have mentioned also the fact that we have a certain competence. While I do respect, certainly, the sharp oppositions being put against the Council tonight, I think by Ms in ‘t Veld, I do not understand that now all at once the Council collectively is responsible for this.

I have told you why I think it is a shame what happened. I think it has to be investigated. I think we have a legal framework. I think there has never been any Council decision being made, as you said, that we would cooperate with the United States on CIA rendition flights, that is simply not true and I would like to see where that has been decided. The only declaration that has been made was after 9/11 to cooperate, as all of us did, with the United States in the fight against terror. If you can show me where you see that the Council collectively is responsible for agreeing on rendition flights, I would be very interested to hear that because that sheds a new light on these events. I would like to be informed on this because you mentioned this in this debate.

I fail to see that point and I am disappointed by it as well, since I have said here, on behalf of the Council, how important I think it is that we learn from what has happened. I understand the quest for accountability. I think that accountability has to be done. I tell you here that we cannot change the competences of the European Union and its institutions; maybe some of the political parties would like to have that, but I cannot change that. It is very easy to blame here the Council in its entirety, you know that it is unjust, it is unfair and I would have liked that this debate would have led to another conclusion, namely that accountability goes where it is supposed to be not simply because there is somebody in front of you. Secondly, that accountability goes through a strong legal system we have in Europe. Thirdly, that we clearly make as a Council together, in its commonality, any discussion we have as the Council that these kinds of human rights violations cannot be accepted, and we will continue to fight for human rights in the context of the necessary fight against terrorism and that we applaud the decisions taken by President Obama.

I hope maybe that can enlighten, nevertheless at the late evening, a little bit this debate, that it does not go on moral high ground or finger pointing but in something that really brings us further in the fight for accountability on these events that have taken place.

 
  
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  Przewodniczący. – Otrzymałem dwa projekty rezolucji złożonych zgodnie z art. 128 ust. 5 Regulaminu.

Zamykam debatę.

Głosowanie odbędzie się w środę 8 czerwca 2016 r.

Oświadczenia pisemne (art. 162)

 
  
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  Laura Ferrara (EFDD), per iscritto. – La lotta al terrorismo non può diventare motivo di impunità e mascherare i crimini di chi non rispetta lo Stato di diritto, la dignità dell'uomo, i diritti umani e le libertà fondamentali. Nonostante la condanna unanime al programma di interrogatori e detenzioni segrete della CIA, nell'ambito del quale si sono verificati rapimenti, torture, trattamenti inumani e degradanti, detenzioni arbitrarie ed illegali, molte ombre permangono sul coinvolgimento e sulle complicità delle autorità di alcuni Stati membri. In alcuni paesi le indagini vanno avanti, in altri si fermano, altrove neanche vengono avviate. Abbiamo visto, infatti, come lo studio della commissione ad hoc del Senato americano non abbia condotto ad alcun tipo di assunzione di responsabilità da parte degli USA, mentre in Europa, nonostante il riconoscimento di violazioni dei diritti fondamentali e di casi di tortura, rimane ancora molto da fare con le indagini e la consegna dei responsabili alla giustizia. Invocare il concetto di "sicurezza nazionale" per nascondere abusi e responsabilità rappresenta un'intollerabile compressione della trasparenza, del controllo democratico e dei diritti fondamentali.

 
  
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  Ramona Nicole Mănescu (PPE), în scris. – Consider că textul Rezoluției referitoare la acțiunile întreprinse ca urmare a Rezoluției Parlamentului European din 11 februarie 2015 privind raportul Senatului SUA referitor la utilizarea torturii de către CIA aduce acuzații grave împotriva unor state membre, fără să ofere dovezile necesare ci bazându-se doar pe un mozaic de titluri de ziar, acuzații venite din zona ONG-urilor și interpretări eronate. Raportul Comitetului pentru Informații al Senatului SUA și Raportul Comisiei Senatului Român asupra prezenței unor centre de detenție ale CIA nu indică niciun fel de dovezi care să demonstreze utilizarea torturii asupra prizonierilor CIA în locații secrete aflate pe teritoriul României.

Mai mult decât atât, textul rezoluției intervine în anchete judiciare naționale aflate în derulare, care au fost demarate tocmai pentru a face lumină în această poveste fără sfârșit și aduce atingere problemelor de securitate națională și suveranitate prin cererea adresată Comisiei Europene de prezentare a unei „Cărți Albe” care „să definească ceea ce nu se încadrează în sfera noțiunii de securitate națională”. Această solicitare încalcă competențele naționale și are potențialul de a se transforma într-o uriașă breșă de securitate pe viitor. Astfel, textul acestei rezoluții nu reflectă nevoile și interesele europenilor, ci pe cele ale Rusiei.

 
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